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Virginia Shooting

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Colin said:
Like said before by different people in this thread,

I'm sure that if I went crazy and wanted a gun I wouldn't know the first place to go, as they just aren't readily available in this country even in the black market.

Gun control does work.
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Who says you need a gun? You need to learn weaponry my friend. :lol:
 
Colin said:
Like said before by different people in this thread,

I'm sure that if I went crazy and wanted a gun I wouldn't know the first place to go, as they just aren't readily available in this country even in the black market.

Gun control does work.
Click to expand...
Colin, it does not work in the UK. BBC story:
The failure of this general disarmament to stem, or even slow, armed and violent crime could not be more blatant. According to a recent UN study, England and Wales have the highest crime rate and worst record for "very serious" offences of the 18 industrial countries surveyed
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Another BBC story:
[FONT=Arial, Verdana, sans-serif]The ban on ownership of handguns was introduced in 1997 as a result of the Dunblane massacre, when Thomas Hamilton opened fire at a primary school leaving 16 children and their teacher dead.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Verdana, sans-serif]But the report suggests that despite the restrictions on ownership the use of handguns in crime is rising. [/FONT] [FONT=Arial, Verdana, sans-serif]The Centre for Defence Studies at Kings College in London, which carried out the research, said the number of crimes in which a handgun was reported increased from 2,648 in 1997/98 to 3,685 in 1999/2000. [/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Verdana, sans-serif]It also said there was no link between high levels of gun crime and areas where there were still high levels of lawful gun possession. [/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Verdana, sans-serif]Of the 20 police areas with the lowest number of legally held firearms, 10 had an above average level of gun crime. [/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Verdana, sans-serif]And of the 20 police areas with the highest levels of legally held guns only two had armed crime levels above the average.[/FONT]
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The last story posted also points out guns ARE still available in the UK and that the ban really did not disarm criminals.
Why should we do what the UK did? It did not work for them, their crime rates, including gun related crimes, rose while ours fell.
 
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You again found those links in the very same gun lobby organization page I told you not to use for very obvious reasons.

The first link is not an article. It's a severely flawed opinion piece from four years ago by an american. Latest official stats from the UK shows that violent crime has dropped over the last decade.

"Between 1995 and 2004/05 British Crime Survey (BCS) violent crime has fallen by 43 per cent"

and

"In 2004/05, 839 deaths were initially recorded as homicide, a decrease of two per cent on the previous year."

Now to your second link...

And I'll just mention two things about that one. First the "research" was done by "Countryside Alliance's Campaign for Shooting". Secondly that was written way back in 2001. I'll leave it at that.

Again, please do make up your own mind by researching real data and stop listening to the gun lobby. Seriously.
 
Peo said:
You again found those links in the very same gun lobby organization page I told you not to use for very obvious reasons.

The first link is not an article. It's a severely flawed opinion piece from four years ago by an american. Latest official stats from the UK shows that violent crime has dropped over the last decade.

"Between 1995 and 2004/05 British Crime Survey (BCS) violent crime has fallen by 43 per cent"

and

"In 2004/05, 839 deaths were initially recorded as homicide, a decrease of two per cent on the previous year."

Now to your second link...

And I'll just mention two things about that one. First the "research" was done by "Countryside Alliance's Campaign for Shooting". Secondly that was written way back in 2001. I'll leave it at that.

Again, please do make up your own mind by researching real data and stop listening to the gun lobby. Seriously.
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Let me get this straight Peo. You believe government over the private sector of the economy? That's enough said right there as to the ignorance of pro-gun control people.
 
No, now you are getting way out there... I own my own business and I've studied business administration at the university. Debate the issue instead of trying to label me something that I am certainly not.
 
Where are you finding all this crap? Look at the graph I posted in this thread from a legitimate source. Firearm homicide has been down since years before the buy back scheme.

Even if home owners did have a gun (not many people owned a gun ever in Australia) and shot an intruder, they would be charged, not the intruder.
 
First one is from 2002 and doesn't cite any source at all.
A page on Angelfire is your next source? For what? It has a couple of links, but no research from what I could see.

I don't have time for this. Make up your own mind by going to real sources, not some quick five second google find or a gun lobby page.
 
Wow jan...a paper posted by your own government...a really trustworthy source. And again, that is old. 02
 
Firearm related deaths in Australia have decreased and that's a fact. "A total of 249 homicide incidents in 2004-05 is the lowest annual number since national monitoring began in 1989" Source
 
Another point is Peo, how about your other homicides. If you can't kill them with a gun, try a bat, brick, knife, or anything you can get your hands on.
 
I think you will have some trouble killing 30+ people that fast with a brick.
 
Peo said:
I think you will have some trouble killing 30+ people that fast with a brick.
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*brick plus rope = a darn good weapon* Try it with watermelons, you'll find it a pretty quick and effective mess. Me and some friends tried it just to see if it was possible and it worked well.
 
Peo said:
You again found those links in the very same gun lobby organization page I told you not to use for very obvious reasons.

The first link is not an article. It's a severely flawed opinion piece from four years ago by an american. Latest official stats from the UK shows that violent crime has dropped over the last decade.

"Between 1995 and 2004/05 British Crime Survey (BCS) violent crime has fallen by 43 per cent"

and

"In 2004/05, 839 deaths were initially recorded as homicide, a decrease of two per cent on the previous year."

Now to your second link...

And I'll just mention two things about that one. First the "research" was done by "Countryside Alliance's Campaign for Shooting". Secondly that was written way back in 2001. I'll leave it at that.

Again, please do make up your own mind by researching real data and stop listening to the gun lobby. Seriously.
Click to expand...
Peo those are BBC links. Gun crime may have fallen since, but the point was it ROSE in the years following the gun control laws. Basically proving that the laws were not responsible for the decline as the fall in crime does not correspond to when the laws went into effect.
 
I guess its time for me to chime in my 2 cents here. Firstly, i would like to say that out hearts and prayers goes out to everyone who lost someone in this horrific incident. No words could ever comfort these familes in such a tragic time. The suggestion of anyone making poking jokes at such a event is absolutely ridicolous. Slip the shoe on your foot for a little while and tell me if you would like it if your sister/brother was slain in a incedent of this nature and someone made tasteless jokes about it, you would be irrate.

Furthermore gun control is not a viable option at this point. As others have stated its not firearms that kill people dead everyday, as matter of fact and weapon used to kill harm mame some one the manufacturer cant be held liable for the actions of people who use the weapon for purposes other than its intended use.

I for one do own a firearm and have no intentions on ever using a weapon on a human being UNLESS i felt that my wife and children where in danger of loosing their lives the yes i would use deadly force. I think the problem that we have as a society in whole (Not Just Americans) is that the overall morals and beliefs are non exsistent anymore. It all boils down to morals, 20-30 years ago things like this where unheard of because people respected one another. You reinstate this type of mentality in society and we as a world would have a much better place to live in.
 
Peo said:
I think you will have some trouble killing 30+ people that fast with a brick.
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I said this earlyer
Dont waste your time fighting with him,
He will just ignore what he cant explain then come back to the same comment 4-5 posts later..
 
I think you will have some trouble killing 30+ people that fast with a brick.
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How fast? If the news story I am remembering was correct, it took him a couple of hours from first victim to the last. And you do not need a gun to kill 30 people fast.You can make a bomb that would fit in a book bag and do it faster. The information to make these types of devices is available on the internet. They are cheaper than guns and made of normal items you can get in a hardware store. Point is if someone wants to kill alot of people, or even just one, they will do it with or without a gun.
 
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