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Virginia Shooting

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The saddest thing I have seen so far is the shame and guilt expressed by the people of the gunman's home country.

I can't quite describe how this made me feel, it made me very melancholy.. But a little angry, too, that these people felt this way.. How unfair it is on them. How unfair it is on everyone, and I include the gunman in this statement.

Watching his video statement, about why, it makes me wonder about what kids do to kids. Certainly he must have had some mental instability beforehand.. How did the system not 'catch' this better? How did the lecturers, now commenting on his 'weird' behaviour and 'scary' writing, fail to do anything, at all?

Just makes me wonder.. I certainly don't pin the blame on any one person, not even the gunman himself. It seems, and it has seemed in previous cases, that these kids are bullied into this.. Whether it's by mockery, betrayal, or other psychological means.

People are cruel. People will endlessly emotionally torture a targeted person. People don't place enough value in trust, morals, loyalty, kindness. (By 'people', please don't assume I am including you.. I think we can all assume the 'people' I am generalising with such sweeping statements.)

It's just a damned shame.

(Sorry, totally ignored your gun debate.. It's been done, and it never goes anywhere new.)
 
Wojtek said:
- U.S. Department of Justice (http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/guns.htm)

Seems only a very small portion of offenders owning a gun used a legal way to purchase theirs.
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There's still too many being able to buy guns legally that should not be able to do so as indicated by the incident that caused us to debate all of this. He did use a legal way to purchase two guns within little more than a month. The fact that he waited a month until he could get his second gun might indicate that he had no fast and easy access to a black market. We don't know, but I think that's a reasonable assumption. In any case as I've said previously, that insane person should not have been able to buy those guns.
 
Peo said:
In any case as I've said previously, that insane person should not have been able to buy those guns.
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And I agree with this statement.

However, please look at Canada for a moment. We don't have "Gold & Guns" :lol: stores up here. To own a firearm you must undergo training, have background checks, permits and a truckload of paperwork.

Exactly what the people against the american gun laws in this thread recommend.

Yet the Dawson shooter last year here in Montreal was a fully qualified gun owner. Everything registered and clean. And he managed to kill 1 and injure 14.

I'm on the side of the "guns dont kill people, people do" argument, yet I'm all for tightening the ownership process.
 
Peo said:
There's still too many being able to buy guns legally that should not be able to do so as indicated by the incident that caused us to debate all of this. He did use a legal way to purchase two guns within little more than a month. The fact that he waited a month until he could get his second gun might indicate that he had no fast and easy access to a black market. We don't know, but I think that's a reasonable assumption. In any case as I've said previously, that insane person should not have been able to buy those guns.
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I agree with parts of that statement.

The fact that the guy was said to be "mentally ill" in 2005 should have some how been picked up by the back ground check. This definitely needs to be tightened up a bit more so people who are mentally unstable can't purchase weapons this easily.

He either didn't have access to black market or he was smart enough to not want any early attention to himself and didn't want to run the risk of getting caught for doing something illegal before he committed this hideous act.

Another thing, I do plead with everyone NOT TO POST his video (which was sent to a news station in th US) on your blogs or anything because that is what he wanted.
 
Wojtek said:
Yet the Dawson shooter last year here in Montreal was a fully qualified gun owner. Everything registered and clean. And he managed to kill 1 and injure 14.

I'm on the side of the "guns dont kill people, people do" argument, yet I'm all for tightening the ownership process.
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What exactly will tightening gun laws do? Enrich the black market? It's the same deal with drugs.. Illegal. Yet, from the age of about 13-14, I knew where to go to get drugs, my friends and school colleagues freely offered their services or services of friends (read: dealer's). I didn't have to do any background work, research .. all I had to do was ask.

Sure, drugs isn't as 'serious' (on some levels, anyway) as purchasing a gun, but.. If he's going to shoot 32 people, why the hell wouldn't he approach the black market to do it? If the gun shop had said 'Sorry, no, we can't sell you a gun', what would he have done? Hmm, joined a gun club? Got friendly with a few guys there, found out where to go? Talk to a college friend? Hell, Google the information? Let's be realistic. The only thing MOST laws do is tell decent people to do what already know to do.. And do absolutely nothing to stop criminals.

Do you think the line of thought 'I'd better not take drugs, it's illegal' ever crossed any of my friends' minds? Please, let's be realistic. Anyone who is willing to shoot 32 people isn't exactly going to be nervous about buying stuff less-than-legally. So it may have slowed him down for what, a week or two while he found the necessary info to make his purchases? But the major point here is, it would have stopped absolutely NOTHING.
 
Wojtek said:
To own a firearm you must undergo training, have background checks, permits and a truckload of paperwork.

Exactly what the people against the american gun laws in this thread recommend.
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Hey I am all for that. I am against a gun BAN. They can institute all the background checks and training they want to insure that only sane persons with no criminal records and the proper traing get guns. But they should not make it so expensive to own a gun that only the very rich can own guns.
 
Wojtek said:
So according to you laz0rkittiesmewmew, what is the universal answer to this? :p
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laz0rkittiesmewmewmew!!

*

Well.. As broad as it sounds, better parenting would go a hell of a long way. When I was growing up, I always KNEW it was wrong to heckle people, to hassle them relentlessly, to tear them down in front of others mercilessly.

I don't blame the kids who teased him (or whatever it is they did to him) for this. But it does raise a few questions..

What happens to someone's psyche when they are constantly ripped to shreds in front of their peers? What happens if you bring them down so low, they feel less than.. well, nothing? It breeds hate. Hate for themselves, hate for the peers treating them that way.

So you're constantly harassed. Made to feel worthless, day in day out. What's to say someone who is a little unbalanced to begin with, wouldn't snap? Wouldn't relate feeling worthless to EVERYONE being worthless? And, hey, if everything is absolutely worthless, what does it matter how you behave or what atrocities you commit, right?
 
But teasing and making fun of other kids is so primary school, not university. I though we got mature people over there.

Maybe he was simply jealous?
You know, 'rich kids', as he puts it, coming to school in new bmw's and mercedes daddy paid for?

But that's no reason to go on a rampage. Everyone starts somewhere. And the way I see it, if you succeed yourself, you've personally succeeded more then the other guy who had it nice all his live.

Maybe he didn't see it that way :confused4
 
Wojtek said:
But teasing and making fun of other kids is so primary school, not university. I though we got mature people over there.

Maybe he was simply jealous?
You know, 'rich kids', as he puts it, coming to school in new bmw's and mercedes daddy paid for?
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People may 'mature', but in some cases, that only makes them crueller.. It might be in the same nasty vein as name-calling, but it's on a completely different level - the bottom line is, people are cruel.

And maybe he was just jealous.. But his statements sounded like a little more than that to me. I guess we will never know, but I think I'm just trying to say, people should realise he is a victim as well. Maybe not a victim we feel sorry for, or remorse. But a victim nonethless.
 
Jun Luzon said:
It's not about you or me, it's about the "deadly weapon" which in this thread's case is a gun. More lethal than a pair of scissor or a kitchen knife. :p
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Ever since 9/11 was started with "box cutters"
*cough government conspiracy*

BTW anhedonia, 3,333 posts!
 
It's every sad, I wonder what america is doing wrong? Which states does this happen in?
 
alley said:
We do have the right to bear arms (Americans) to protect us from maniacs like that freak!
Who is going to protect us? .. the police? ...by the time they got there 40 people were dead.

Like I said early if somebody else had a gun there they could have prevented some of those killings as well.
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And if no one had a gun there would be nothing to prevent..
 
Jun Luzon said:
Keeps me wondering why this debate doesn't seem to end.
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It just did.

We could debate the issue indefinitely, but the reality is 32 innocent people died at the hands of a gunman. I sincerely hope they rest in peace. Condolences to their families, friends, school mates, families of similar crimes and anyone else who is affected by this in any way. I think it has reached world wide proportions of people affected, one way or another.
 
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