Should Youhosting resellers be banned here?

[CS Squad]

If a hoster is really serious in this hosting business, he will spend some money for his hosting service.
Using co-branded reseller isn't spending money.
Although some of them might be upgraded to the VIP youhosting account, but still, if they are really serious about their business, they will not choose to be a co-branded reseller at the first place.
Upgrading to Youhosting VIP is only very cheap in price, which these hosters can even afford to not paying any attention to the users.
I've seen a lot of these co-branded resellers, I would say, most of them, just leave the hosting service run and earn from the forced footer ads and do not even care about the users. Support tickets were never replied.

 

[ace2010]

CS Squad why do you believe that if someone pay for his free host (the VPS plan at your sig start from $7) that will make him to care for his clients ???
(the upgrades at youhosting is $20 and $40 per month at byet start from $10 to $30 and at resellercluster for Private DNS from $20 to $60)

i choose to be a reseller cuz i do not want to maintain the server and i do not want to have to stop the spammers and the abusers, not cuz i cant afford a VPS

and the problem is not if a free host offers quality services, in the free hosting offers there is many crappy hosts offers but none cares
the problem is if the forum will flood with offers from copycat free hosts, this can be easily solved with some rules

eg the host have to ...
- have your own domain name, no free domains
- be online for some time (6 months, 1 year etc)
- have some google PR
- have a tasteful design (this will show the webmaster spend some time for his site)
- allow to post offers once a month and not every 7 days
- have x number of hosted domains
and many other rules or requirements

 

[Trel]

CS Squad why do you believe that if someone pay for his free host (the VPS plan at your sig start from $7) that will make him to care for his clients ???
(the upgrades at youhosting is $20 and $40 per month at byet start from $10 to $30 and at resellercluster for Private DNS from $20 to $60)

That is an easy one. Cobranded providers don't have any control over the platform. It is more of a referral than actually hosting the accounts.

A $7 VPS running NGNIX with PHP-FPM might be able to host a single website, but it won't be used for providing actual shared webhosting. Those start at $20 or more per month for a bare bones system and cPanel.

 

[ace2010]

i would like to say a big "THANK YOU" to the guy who give me negative reputation in this thread with the comment bellow
"I've seen enough co-branded host making enough issues. They fighting among themself and caused chaos too!"


also i would like to ask the forum admins if i have the right to express my opinion ??????

 

[Peo]

I see no reason to -rep you for giving your opinon on this. You have the right to do that. Don't pay too much attention to the reputation system though.

 

[CS Squad]

i would like to say a big "THANK YOU" to the guy who give me negative reputation in this thread with the comment bellow
"I've seen enough co-branded host making enough issues. They fighting among themself and caused chaos too!"


also i would like to ask the forum admins if i have the right to express my opinion ??????

Since you asked, then I am now letting you know that -rep is from me.
The -rep is not an infraction or what, so it does not mean I am stopping you from expressing your opinion.
It is merely for disagreement of that particular statement.

Regarding your points:

- have your own domain name, no free domains

Do you know nowadays anyone can have a domain name as easy as buying a McDonalds meal?
There are even some kiddo host, have a .com domain name sponsored by someone.

- be online for some time (6 months, 1 year etc)

It is too easy to do so for a person who is using a co-branded reseller, as they just need to point the domain to either byet or youhosting and leave it there for half a year without even need to maintain it at all.
But for a legit host who take out money themself, it would be a challenge to them, but well, if they want to be in business, they should take the challenge.
But then again, this will make it easier for those co-branded host to colonize this whole community and ends up everyone is offering the same thing.
Hence causing users to become difficult to find a good host who will actually be responsible to the support ticketing respond.
Unlike most co-branded reseller, most of them do not even care to reply the support tickets at all.

- have some google PR

Easy to achieve, but then again, this is not advertiser looking for a blog with PR ranks to post advertorial in the blog.
Of course, most of us here already have certain PR rank for our domain, but then again, it will going to cause the moderators here have too much work to do by checking each new co-branded reseller who appear here.
As you can see, if allow co-branded reseller to post offer here, it will means, every day there will be at least 20 to 30 new co-branded reseller to signup here and post offers which is exactly the same spec. Unnecessary workload will be created to the moderator by this.

- have a tasteful design (this will show the webmaster spend some time for his site)

How do you determine by who tasteful is a website? Any specific criteria?
From what I know, a lot of big host and even data centers, their website doesn't looks fancy. But they are trustworthy and already been in the business for very long time and hosted thousands of websites and servers.

- allow to post offers once a month and not every 7 days

No comment about this. But most other web hosting forums also put 7 days as the limit, so it is best to leave it as 7 days.

- have x number of hosted domains

Anyone can cheat on the stats.
Even fake evidence can be produced and there are no way to check the authenticity of the stats.
Unless the admin password is given to the moderators to login and check, which I believe people will rather leave here than giving out their admin password to the moderators here.

 

[Seraphim]

- have your own domain name, no free domains

I'll agree with this one, because although domain names have become so cheap so many hosts aren't even willing to put up that much investment to get one.

- be online for some time (6 months, 1 year etc)

I'm actually against this. The reason being is that in the early days of my host, I came here and advertised in order to get my first few customers- several of which I retain to this day. Now a time requirement of active hosting and advertising works for a 'veteran host' usergroup entry requirement, but it does not really work for new hosts coming here because age of the company has no bearing at all on how active they are in the business- someone who is on the job every day but has only been going at it a month would be turned away while somebody who made the setup then forgot about it 6 months can post away.

- have some google PR

This can be difficult to check, and really is only relevant for hosting startups that have been successful or did active SEO in order to forcibly raise their pagerank. I don't believe it can be a reliable or effective indicator.

- have a tasteful design (this will show the webmaster spend some time for his site)

So then you would almost certainly deny me because my website looks a bit old. I've spent hours and days developing that, handwriting all of the PHP and CSS that powers it complete with the SQL backend. But I am an engineer not an artist, making something functional is far easier for me than making it look nice. In time I may hire a web developer to go through at least the CSS and make it look a bit better, but I don't think that it would matter because the appeal of a design is completely dependent on personal preference. And I for one actually prefer a stripped-down bare iron design to a fancy fluffy chrome and leather finish.

- allow to post offers once a month and not every 7 days

A lot of hosts ignore the time requirement, although just as many get infractions for it too. However not all hosts even post offers- I actually avoid that section of the forum because I found it draws far too many bots for my liking and my offers do not stand out in the flood.

- have x number of hosted domains

I don't see the relevance of this. Although ideally a host should have at least two domains- their name in .com and .net so as to avoid name squatting if they are successful. But manually checking for this would be a great deal of work, and a lot of hosts only bought the name they intend to actually use so they have no extras.

and many other rules or requirements

The thicker the rulebook becomes the less likely people are to read it and obey it. Whatever amendments are made here, they need to be kept simple and effective.

 

[ace2010]

CS Squad and Seraphim those are just some thoughts and will worth to talk more about them if we agree that some resellers have to get the right to post offers

as long you guys do not agree with any changes then there is no point to talk about the requirements

 

[Peo]

I think ace2010 ment that the requirements he mentioned should only be for cobranded free hosts (or resellers). If they meet the requirements they can post ads to a subcategory in Free hosting offers. Now, some of those requirements are time consuming to check but others might be possible.

What do you think about the idea to let cobranded hosts who can point to certain achievements post ads in a subcategory to Free hosting offers?

 

[Seraphim]

It would be an acceptable compromise perhaps, since that would eliminate a lot of the troublesome half-baked startups by making them jump a few hoops that are avoided by those who actually invest into this kind of thing. If someone actually bought a domain name and just started out with a cobrand in order to conserve limited funding early on, they might still have the motivation to get somewhere in the business and not vanish suddenly like many of the all-free arrangements do.

Likewise, hosts that arent' using resellers or cobrands probably wouldn't hurt to have a few requirements such as a valid paid TLD like a .com and at least a VPS as the basis for their services. Although business registration would probably be a big help, not all regions support that and the procedures for it vary from region to region. As has been brought to my attention on other sites, other countries handle such things radically different to the extent that it cannot be used as a uniform standard.

 

[CS Squad]

If the rules is only applies for co-branded resellers, then I have a few suggestions here.
Instead of the rules suggested at above by ace, I think the below rules will be safer for everyone.

1. Co-branded reseller can only post offers and response to hosting request in the co-branded forum section. The existing free hosting and paid hosting offer and request section, co-branded resellers are not allowed to post their offer there. This is to avoid confusion that cause the user mistake that they are normal cPanel/DirectAdmin hosting provider. But co-branded resellers allowed to join the discussions in these sections without offering any of their plans.

2. Co-branded reseller must have a tld domain name which is more than 1 years old. Because it is easy for a person to buy a domain name, and if it only sustains for half year, it does not shows that they pay attention to their service, while those who did pay some attention to their service, will be definitely renew their domain to continue provide their service.

3. Co-branded reseller are allowed to post offer in the co-branded offer section every 14 days instead of 7 days, since of FWS opened for co-branded host, this place will be full of co-branded resellers, and excessive postings of offers in the co-branded offer section will make it hard for people to follow up the offer updates in that particular section.

4. Co-branded must fill up a form to let the moderator know that they are co-branded reseller to make the moderator easier to handle their task, such as if see any of these co-branded reseller is posting in other offer sections and request sections, they can remove those post, as they are not allowed to post offers in those sections.
A special user group will assigned to these users in order to make the moderators easier to identify them.

5. Any co-branded reseller who are not registered, will not having the rights to post offers in the co-branded offer sections and cannot be accepted as a host, but will only be considered as a normal user who are not allowed to post any offers.

 

[dmmcintyre3]

A $7 VPS running NGNIX with PHP-FPM might be able to host a single website

I have been hosting multiple sites off of $1.25/month VPSs with nginx for a long time.

 

[Trel]

I have been hosting multiple sites off of $1.25/month VPSs with nginx for a long time.

Using a 512MB VPS ($7 mentioned above), you can install ISPConfig, NGNIX, PHP-FPM, eAccelerator/APC, MySQL, and an email daemon for a full production environment capable of hosting websites receiving hundreds/thousands of visitors per hour.

Using a 128MB VPS ($1.25 mentioned above), you can install NGNIX, PHP-FPM, and that is about it. You can attempt to install MySQL as well, but it will not perform well without the additional ram for cache.

 

[dmmcintyre3]

My install scripts set up PHP 5.3.x (with APC added), nginx (latest version) and MySQL 5.5 (without innodb, and enough caching to run what I needed with good performance) use around 128mb RAM on an OpenVZ VPS and 50-60mb on a KVM/Xen/VMWare/(anything without allocation based memory limits) VPS.

 

[CS Squad]

Yeah, we can actually get a low end VPS to host websites, but nowadays, those co-branded reseller don't even bother to care about how to setup these and just dependent on the Youhosting to do all the work, and they just point their domain to Youhosting and just leave it running, without even care to reply support tickets...

 

[wswd]

Not really sure why we're talking about $1.25 VPS servers. You're not going to run a hosting company off of one of them, so what's the point?

 

[ace2010]

the talking about the cheap VPS servers is for show how easy and cheap is to make a free host witch will be allowed to post offers
also for show that paying for hosting does not mean that you will offer quality service or that this host will have any reliability.

 

[wswd]

the talking about the cheap VPS servers is for show how easy and cheap is to make a free host witch will be allowed to post offers
also for show that paying for hosting does not mean that you will offer quality service or that this host will have any reliability.

Okay, so you're going to create a free host with a VPS that can host 3 people and no control panel? Really?

 

[wswd]

My biggest problem, besides people running illegal businesses and not making investments of any kind to run that so-called "business" is the fact that resellers have absolutely no control over the server.

When it comes to things like resellers, master resellers, super uber alpha-omega resellers, etc., the actual client is sometimes 3 or 4 pegs down the chain from the actual company who has control over the server. To get something accomplished, the client has to submit a ticket to the reseller, who has to submit a ticket to the master reseller, who then submits a ticket to the VPS owner, who has to contact the dedicated server company, etc., etc.

While just about everyone is at the mercy of the datacenter, in one way or another (unless you own your datacenter), hosts with dedicated servers or VPS have a certain control over their servers that the resellers simply don't, and never will. And I'm not just picking on the co-branded folk here. That applies to all resellers.

 

[Trel]

I think there is still a significant difference between resellers and cobranded providers. Reseller providers no matter how many levels from the end user still have an incentive to keep the servers up and running smoothly: money.

If the server begins to perform poorly, you can cancel and move your accounts somewhere else. Cobranded providers can't do anything like that because they have lost control of the platform.