FWS needs to shape up

[The Crasher]

ok lets provide a bit of reply and comment

i am to lazy to make a quote and filter the text out so i going post custom quote

hosts that use Nulled/Cracked whmcs and other billing programs should not be allowed , they destroy our business

i totaly agree with the above thing , a host that does not even can pay for there own secure billing system ??
the billing system is the most needed part , and nulled/cracked stuff got a LOT of security bugs ( check nulled vbulletin vs original , nulled whmcs vs original ... they contains a LOT of difference )

host that allow nulled software to be hosted should not be allowed to post here

i need to dissagree this part
if you look at me , i am a host and i got a tos
i do not allow nulled/cracked software to be hosted but i do not care eather as long it does not get reported
hosting nulled software does not harm your system or your name as host , as long the user take action when needed is everything fine

internet is created to share stuff , i understand why people use nulled software (i use it for testing purpose as example) and users should be allowed to do what they like to do
but ofcourse there are certain limits , if reports get in then it need to be deleted , but if no1 complain then who would care ??

example is based on my download site , if i need to delete every single copyright that is located on it then i think i can close that site as there is always some1 who upload something that is not allowed , then i need to check every single file the complete day long to be sure that it is legal ?

does that means if a user post harmfull scripts that you allow it to ?

harmfull scripts are a differend story , those are not warez/nulled stuff and does harm your system , so thats definaly not something you like to have

hopely this explained the difference of what i mean

so i partial agree , but complaining about nulled stuff that they allow to download is a other story (before i forget it , all those hosts here never downnloaded nulled stuff , never watch movie's online and never listen to music online because they hate it that some1 is sharing illigal stuff ... )

Greetings From PowerChaos

 

[deeplist]

i do not allow nulled/cracked software to be hosted but i do not care eather as long it does not get reported

You're basically saying that you don't crack down on people hosting illegal software as long as nobody makes a stink about it?? Are you serious? That shows us a little bit about your business ethics.

hosting nulled software does not harm your system or your name as host , as long the user take action when needed is everything fine

Once again? WTF? Hosting nulled software ABSOLUTELY harms your name as a host. Who in their right mind would want their ligitimate content hosted on a machine along with others who (you openly admit here) host illegal software?

internet is created to share stuff , i understand why people use nulled software (i use it for testing purpose as example) and users should be allowed to do what they like to do but ofcourse there are certain limits , if reports get in then it need to be deleted , but if no1 complain then who would care ??

I honestly can't believe that you're posting that here. This "offshore" crap is nonsense. Because you're based in the Netherlands, that somehow allows you to have a different mindset than the rest of the globe? Piracy should not be tolerated regardless of where you are in the world or whether there are local laws regarding it.

 

[Dynash]

I was hoping this thread was going to be about FWS changing, not this topic again.

 

[deeplist]

I was hoping this thread was going to be about FWS changing, not this topic again.

There won't be any change here... ever. Even extremely minute and insignificant changes take them weeks (and sometimes even months) to come to a conclusion on and put into effect.

 

[The Crasher]

my point goes about 1 thing only

you say that illigal is not allowed

it is indeed not allowed to post illigal stuff , but you just care to mutch

i can show you a link to a whmcs install that i am ALLOWED to use , but shows not valid if you check it ( because its a developer license)

i can place legal files on a host that looks illigal
i can show you files that you would instand delete because they look not legal to you but are 100% legal because it is placed there by the creator

i can show you files that get marked as illigal but are legal if you take a closer look to the complain that get sended about it

i do not say that i like it that they host illigal files , but what is illigal ... it is illigal if it get reported
as long it does not get reported .. how you know it is illigal ??

I honestly can't believe that you're posting that here. This "offshore" crap is nonsense. Because your based in the NL allows you to have a different mindset than the rest of the globe? Piracy should not be tolerated regardless of where you are in the world or whether there are local laws regarding it.

so you are cliaming that you never downloaded a illigal file , that you never downloader or even edited a movie (because editing a movie is illigal)
that you do not have music on your pc or on your ipad exept buyed from a LEGAL online store ( so you pay 25€ per cd you want to have )
because ripping a cd with music to your hd is only legal if it is coded and can not be used on a other pc/device ( you can legaly have 1 backup .. ripping it to your pc is your backup)

there are so many more things i can say , and i wanna bet that there is atleast 1 thing you are gulty on it to (if you like it or not )

to say a other easy example , you never vistit a torrent site or a site that contains torrents ... as they are illigal in some country's (piratebay is blocked in netherlands )

but who says that torrents are illigal , if i want to place my script in a torrent then it is a 100% legal torrent ... but you need to download my torrent first to know it for sure ...

hopely this shows what i mean with this

it does not mean i like illigal or that i want to have illigal stuff
i do take action about illigal stuff and definaly after complains
but i do not search for it as it is a useless fight to search for illigal stuff that maybe can be located on my server

Greetings From PowerChaos

 

[iBrightDev]

PowerChaos, this thread has nothing to do with downloading torrents or hosting torrent sites or what have you, but, it is about the point that new hosts are popping up all the time using pirated versions of WHMCS that are scamming and creating issues.

 

[The Crasher]

PowerChaos, this thread has nothing to do with downloading torrents or hosting torrent sites or what have you, but, it is about the point that new hosts are popping up all the time using pirated versions of WHMCS that are scamming and creating issues.

i realy need to agree on that part
there need to be taken actions against that stuff
but thats where the part i partial agreed , i readed the first page and they are complaining about nulled software
but i toaly agree that a host itself shoulnd use any kind of nulled software

but about the clients is a other story

Greetings From PowerChaos

 

[iBrightDev]

if a host cant afford WHMCS, then they have no need to be in business. If they are just cheap and dont want to pay, there are great alternatives out there for free or cheaper than WHMCS. But, the part about clients, you, as a hosting provider, can get in trouble or shut down for what your clients host, so, it should be your concern if they are hosting pirated software or something illegal. if you get larger, it can become tricky to hunt down what every client is doing, and that is when you hire people to work for you, or you just do random checks on different sites daily as part of your daily routine of things that need to be done. it is important to stay on top of these things. i let a friend host a CRM on my server for testing, not knowing that it had a virus, and it messed up every site on my server and i had to go install backup files just to remove the virus. that is just one example of why it is important to check things.

 

[Sain Cai]

i need to dissagree this part
if you look at me , i am a host and i got a tos
i do not allow nulled/cracked software to be hosted but i do not care eather as long it does not get reported
hosting nulled software does not harm your system or your name as host , as long the user take action when needed is everything fine

internet is created to share stuff , i understand why people use nulled software (i use it for testing purpose as example) and users should be allowed to do what they like to do
but ofcourse there are certain limits , if reports get in then it need to be deleted , but if no1 complain then who would care ??

example is based on my download site , if i need to delete every single copyright that is located on it then i think i can close that site as there is always some1 who upload something that is not allowed , then i need to check every single file the complete day long to be sure that it is legal ?

Are you ----ing kidding me? By saying you simply do not care what people host, and you do not check to see what people host, you are every bit as bad as iegyi. Why anyone would want to be hosted with you now seeing how you can be closed at any moment for copyright infringement, is beyond me.

 

[iBrightDev]

Are you ----ing kidding me? By saying you simply do not care what people host, and you do not check to see what people host, you are every bit as bad as iegyi. Why anyone would want to be hosted with you now seeing how you can be closed at any moment for copyright infringement, is beyond me.

maybe cause he allows torrent sites?

 

[Jan]

internet is created to share stuff , i understand why people use nulled software (i use it for testing purpose as example) and users should be allowed to do what they like to do
but ofcourse there are certain limits , if reports get in then it need to be deleted , but if no1 complain then who would care ??

The internet is not for stealing from software developers. No matter how you justify it, it is still stealing.

 

[stuffradio]

The internet is not for stealing from software developers. No matter how you justify it, it is still stealing.

Amen.

 

[Seraphim]

i totaly agree with the above thing , a host that does not even can pay for there own secure billing system ??

I don't pay for mine, never have and never will.

Of course, I also wrote it myself from the ground up.

If anything it is actually more secure that way because by not using a commonplace software packages, the only possible exploits are 0-day attacks that I do not yet know about. Someone can't just go download a common exploit for the software I use because they know the version I am running has this whole big list of exploits, they have to actually probe my software and find them on their own.

i need to dissagree this part
if you look at me , i am a host and i got a tos
i do not allow nulled/cracked software to be hosted but i do not care eather as long it does not get reported
hosting nulled software does not harm your system or your name as host , as long the user take action when needed is everything fine

So you are the kind of indifferent host that allows such malicious activity as email spam and distribution of malware on your services because as long as nobody says anything to you about it you don't care if your services are being used to cause problems for other people.

I am sorry, but I have to ask. Have you no sense of right and wrong at all? It is that attitude that has allowed the internet to accumulate the filth it has and made such a huge problem of network security. You've probably got CnC nodes and everything on your services that you simply haven't noticed yet.

internet is created to share stuff , i understand why people use nulled software (i use it for testing purpose as example) and users should be allowed to do what they like to do
but ofcourse there are certain limits , if reports get in then it need to be deleted , but if no1 complain then who would care ??

The internet was created to share ideas and information, not to share private property like licensed software or media. If somebody can claim a copyright on it, you are stealing from them. Would you go to their store and steal a package off their shelf? I should hope not.

example is based on my download site , if i need to delete every single copyright that is located on it then i think i can close that site as there is always some1 who upload something that is not allowed , then i need to check every single file the complete day long to be sure that it is legal ?

Then you should not be running such a site, or should run it in a way that it yields sufficient income to pay people to check for you. I'm sure there are plenty of people out there who would gladly accept $.02 a file or so to verify new uploads to make sure they are not infringing on copyrights.

harmfull scripts are a differend story , those are not warez/nulled stuff and does harm your system , so thats definaly not something you like to have

But if your policy is don't ask don't tell regarding the content of your clients, how do you know what they are or are not hosting. You really wouldn't know unless something horrible happened as a direct result of your neglect. How do you sleep at night under such conditions?

I'm also all in favor of a badly-needed cleanup of FWS. My reasons should be fairly obvious in my statements above, but also this:

When I joined FWS shortly after bringing my host online, there was a steady supply of people here. Even a slow day yielded at least 8 new request threads in each relevant section, and there was a plentiful and competitive market in the offers section with reasonable hosting offers in good abundance.

What do I see now? Maybe a scattering of posts at all in the hosting requests section, most of them for illegal or unreasonable requests. And the offers section is overrun with bots and pseudo-bot advertising. It was the lack of such things here that made me join FWS instead of going elsewhere to advertise my fledgeling host.

The things I came here for at first are gone, and everyone here could really use getting them back. Even if it means a complete staff overhaul- get rid of every single staff member who has not taken action in the past week, and choose new staff who will regularly tend to the needs of this site. Otherwise, FWS is doomed.

 

[deeplist]

The things I came here for at first are gone, and everyone here could really use getting them back. Even if it means a complete staff overhaul- get rid of every single staff member who has not taken action in the past week, and choose new staff who will regularly tend to the needs of this site. Otherwise, FWS is doomed.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

 

[The Crasher]

i just say that i do not care mutch about it

i got a differend vieuw on the things then you have
and probaly i explain it wrong

but i still take care of security , i know what happends on my server because varius log systems that are implented to my system

like the emails , i monitor emails and yes ... i take care about spammers as that is something differend then software
i take care of 'abusers' and other things , and i even know exact what users are uploading if they contain any of the code i do not like (got logs )

the big point i mean with this is

why would it harm any1 that is testing out a file ?? why would any1 care if they are testing out a system ?? ( for personal use for example)
why would some1 care if they are storing a torrent or a big file on your server if it does not abuse any resources ??

if you like , feel free to check my servers and i am sure you wont find mutch on it

the war against illigality is a big war , it is hard to fight against all illigal stuff
but then back again , what is called illigal and what not ??
if i place a trial of adobe photoshop CS5 on my server ?? is it then warez ( yes it is because it is a full version for 30 days ... )

do you know from your users if the files they post are warez ?? or are you 1 of those hosts that limits what they can upload ( only html files allowed ... like most freehosts )

i do random checks on files , i got logs and i do check my clients where i get strange reports from (emails .. email rulez )

but to get back to the point i mean

warez is a totaly differend world , it has nothing to do with trust or with allowing or not
for the damage part you got a TOS ( use it ) and how ever you look at it , it is still the client there responsibility

i am tired of keeping repeating myself with the same answers
but it is not that i do not care about warez that i do not take actions ( there are limits )
but the main point stays the same

what is called warez ?? when you know that you got warez ??

and then a little comment about "checking clients there files"
ever heard of a privacy policy ??

why would some1 trust you with his files if you "check" there files all the time ??
what if he is using it for a project ( like i do ) ... , for me it is like destroying my privacy

the least thing you can do is warn the client , but i bet you do not even do that if you find a possible warez file

but again
there is still a difference betwean client and host
its my job to keep the server alive , its my job to protect the server from damage
but it is not my job to say to clients what they can do and what not , if they do something wrong then they will pay for the damage they are making

if a client like to host a nulled script ... and i get complains then he will take care of the damage
or are you going search every client if he got a nulled script ( so open php files to figure out if his whmcs is nulled ?? )


anyway
how ever you look to it
warez is illigal , but when is it warez
i bet no1 even heard of the fair use policy ?? (go search for the meaning of it )

i take action if needed but if not needed and it doesnt harm my company in anyway why would i care about it
why would i hire 3 extra staff just to find possible warez ?

but to stop to go offtopic , if you want to discuse this with me then feel free to make a new topic so we stay ontopic

this goes about nulled billing systems that get used by noobs so it looks like they are hosts but does not even know what apache means

ps:
if you can not keep your server alive because 1 noob is hosting warez on it ... then i guess you search a other job
it is harder to keep a server running when they are abusing it , but that proofs that you can realy do your job unlike other hosts that can not keep there server online when some1 is 'abusing' there system
if you like to hire 3 extra unknown staff .. or want to pay them a full month loan (like 1600€ per month ) to provide them acces to your system. .thats what you need to know
but it is a security risk to give people acces to a server when you do not even know them

but thats a other story
how ever you look at it
warez is illigal
but that does not mean that i need to care mutch about it ...

then to provide a offer
feel free to daily check my server and my clients if they host warez .. if you find let me know
but i guess you wont find it at this moment , because users who are hosting warez are mostly the users who are abusing your system to
and the other "smart" people wont abuse your system as they know what they do and they wont harm your system or provide you problems ( as they do not store warez on your server and they use legal stuff for there site ... )

sorry for the long post , but it is hard to explain
Greetings From PowerChaos

 

[Sain Cai]

Firstly, a trial offer is not warez. Its a trial, same thing as a demo.
Secondly, privacy policies do not apply to files that are uploaded to be distributed. All that Clinton internet bull---- does not cover someone from illegally distributing material.
Thirdly, your opinion on warez certainly is different then the reputable hosts and clients here. Illegal is not cool, period.
Fourthly, warez are anything that is copyrighted and not meant for distribution aside from authorized locations.
Fifthly, if you are going to be a ---- and try to weasel your way out with sayings like "what is illegal and what isnt" then you shouldnt be in business.

Hosts routinely check to see what they are hosting. Why on earth would a host want illegal files on their servers when they can easily be sued for allowing it? I am wondering if it is simple ignorance to think that hosting illegal material isnt going to be your problem, or if you are simply too stupid to give a damn. Either way, I am shocked to see you are still allowed to post here after an admission that you simply do not care if people upload illegal ---- to your host when 2 mods came strolling through.

Rest assured, if I were to become mod any mention of allowing illegal material would be a permaban as far as I am concerned. I have a 0 tolerance policy on illegal hosting or activity, too bad others do not seem to share that point of view.

 

[The Crasher]

every1 got his own point of vieuw about this thing

to provide something funny
dit you know that windows became that populair because a lot of users are using a illigal version of windows ( when linux is freeware )
dit you know that most iphones are cracked just to get some nice stuff on it that providers are not allowing ( like internet thetering .. using 3g to get on internet with your laptop , or just not to complain about simlocks .. )

my point still stay the same

i do care about warez , i do not like warez eather , but i do not going spend all my value hours on searching possible warez and kicking my clients because they are possible hosting warez

go take a look outside your door , knock on your friend his door or just take a look at your friend his computer and then say that you dump him as friend because he is playing a game that is not "legal"

then about the sue part
i guess you need to learn a few laws first before starting to complain about those parts
i would suggest to start learning first the meaning of a TOS ( Terms of Service ) , as that is the first thing that prevent you ( as company ) from any damage that a client can do if you take the needed action

i do understand that you do not see the things the same as i do and that it is hard to follow what i try to say

there are more laws over internet then you probaly know of

to give a example , you got the fair use policy , to say it in short -> can be used to share copyright files as long you do not use it to make profit and does not harm the company
then to get back to that trial , it is illigal to post a trial if you do not got permision (like adobe , they got there own downloader to prevent sharing of the trial file .. so hosting it -> illigal )

about your 0 tolerance
it is your choise to deal with warez on your way, i got my way to deal with it and that does not make you any better then me

i know what i do and how to take care of , i know how to stay out of problems and to solve the problems and as long i know that then everything is fine for me

so complaning that i shoulnd be in business is a other story , some1 who know what he does is just perfect for a business , first rule of a business is to find a way to protect yourself from damage

but every1 got his own way and vieuw about things , the best part is in how far you can deal with it and how good you can solve the problems

anyway
enouf talk about me, open a new topic if you realy want to keep talking about my vieuw and the difference betwean others there vision

this topic goes about the nulled billing systems they are using
and on that part i need to totaly agree that it is not good ( and yes i take action about that to )
but warez on his own is still a other story and not that easy as you think it is

last thing i going say
internet got still 1 nice rule

sharing and downloading -> allowed
Uploading -> illigal

so sharing links and downloading files are all good and legal (never wondered why rapidshare/megaupload and those other file hosts are still online ... they never contain warez or do they ? hmm )
but uploading a file is not legal , so the uploader is responsible for the damage

why is that rule so easy ?? because if you can not upload how you should be able to download/share ?? , you just cant

as long that law does not change then we are back where we are now located

Greetings From PowerChaos

 

[stuffradio]

i guess you need to learn a few laws first before starting to complain about those parts
i would suggest to start learning first the meaning of a TOS ( Terms of Service ) , as that is the first thing that prevent you ( as company ) from any damage that a client can do if you take the needed action

ToS has not been tested in the court. It's a crap shoot whether that would protect you in the court of law. Ignorance is not a defense in court.

as long that law does not change then we are back where we are now located

Well, there is a bill in the US congress that is expected to pass this or next week that would change all that... and shut the internet down as we know it. Luckily, I don't live in the US

Rest assured, if I were to become mod any mention of allowing illegal material would be a permaban as far as I am concerned.

We're discussing it. It's not the same as requesting it. I can't just ban for that.

 

[deanhills]

The post you reported today had no URL for us to check. So we only have your word that the site is using pirated software.

So you would rather us just remove the offending posts and leave all the trolling replies, that would be even more meaningless without members knowing what you were on about, then?

I really do think FWS is a great place, particularly for having a Free Website Host Directory, but there may be a point to this thread. It is an AMAZING coincidence. As you know, I post at Frihost, and during one of our most recent discussions one of the Frihosters complained that while he was trying to put a review up on the FWS Directory that his anti-virus picked up on a mal advertisement. I've just sent a copy of the print screen to Peo.

I'm really sorry that happened, as of course it acts to discourage others to visit the Directory. I immediately told the discussion that Peo has very high standards for his Website and that I'm certain that he would be dealing with the complaint immediately. But how is it possible for something like that to slip through?

 

[Peo]

Thanks for reporting it Dean. I've never heard of that antivirus program. For some reason it blocked a tiny co.cc button ad hosted from co.cc. It doesn't contain any malware, but I have removed it.